Guns, race, religion, terror, wingnut thread

[JTA]

If they’re offended I question their motivations because the blue in the Confederate battle flag represents St. Andrew who was an apostle of Jesus Christ and he was Jewish and makes me wonder if they’re anti-Semitic.

I wonder who fed him that line. I also wonder if he asked what "anti-Semitic" means.

It means "one who criticizes Israel"

[Seth Milner]

[rstrong]

In BOTH cases the NRA gets equal blame. The shooters, too.

The difference is that in the black church case, no-one denies that racism was a prime factor. The shooter and his ilk made the flag front and center. A flag that very people who created it, made clear that it was about race and slavery.

What the post-attack uproar says about those who fly the Confederate Battle Flag is nothing new. It simply restated the obvious.

Answer this: (Though no doubt you'll evade, change the subject or run away.)

Do you honestly not see the difference?

[O Really]

Thinking people are mad at the NRA every day, whether any kids get killed or not. Of course, there aren't many days that some kid doesn't get shot in the US. The NRA may not directly support or cause people to shoot other people, but it is by far the primary reason why nothing gets done (or attempted) and the CDC isn't even allowed (funded) to conduct research on firearm injuries/fatalities. What's not to hate about the NRA? It actively opposes common sense safety measures that it once proposed. It offers as the only solution "more guns" yet there really isn't any significant restriction on firearm purchase and ownership now. Those who don't have firearms, don't have them by choice. Not because they are not allowed. Might we assume the NRA would like to require by law everyone to walk around armed?

[Vrede too]

Also, there was no indication that the mixed race guy was motivated by racism like the white guy was and, as both rstrong and O Really imply, there was no shortage of criticism of the NRA in the wake of the Charleston massacre.

You poster is inaccurate, racist and dumb, Seth Milner.

[Seth Milner]

Answer this: (Though no doubt you'll evade, change the subject or run away.) Do you honestly not see the difference?

Why should I run? Is Vrede too rubbing off on you?
I see the NRA, (which I have no use for) being blamed because they are staunch supporters of the 2nd. Amendment.
I see silly knee-jerk claims being launched at a piece of cloth.
I see silly comments and vile names being thrown at people who wish to defend their rights to own weapons, while blaming gun-related crimes on those who support gun rights as if gun-owners are responsible for criminals having guns. Gun control will work exactly as well as the war on drugs and the Prohibition. Everything will go as smooth as clockwork.

Thinking people are mad at the NRA every day, whether any kids get killed or not.
Of course, there aren't many days that some kid doesn't get shot in the US. The NRA may not directly support or cause people to shoot other people, but it is by far the primary reason why nothing gets done (or attempted) and the CDC isn't even allowed (funded) to conduct research on firearm injuries/fatalities. What's not to hate about the NRA? It actively opposes common sense safety measures that it once proposed. It offers as the only solution "more guns" yet there really isn't any significant restriction on firearm purchase and ownership now. Those who don't have firearms, don't have them by choice. Not because they are not allowed. Might we assume the NRA would like to require by law everyone to walk around armed?

This is what I mean about blaming the NRA. Every gun crime is directly or indirectly blamed on the NRA because they fiercely support the 2nd. Amendment. This is the liberal way. Let's say gun control of some way, shape, or form is enacted; now what? Honest people will be the ones to suffer most, because despite any measures in place, some crooked somebody somewhere is going to skirt any laws just to make money. It's already been seen in the news.

Also, there was no indication that the mixed race guy was motivated by racism like the white guy was and, as both rstrong and O Really imply, there was no shortage of criticism of the NRA in the wake of the Charleston massacre.
Obviously the motivation, to you, was the NRA's opposition to the notion that individual gun ownership is to blame for all crime. Naturally, honest gun-owners are to blame for all gun-related crimes.

You poster is inaccurate, racist and dumb, Seth Milner.
La dee da. Your NPD fogged mind will get over it.

[Vrede too]

In BOTH cases the NRA gets equal blame. The shooters, too.

The difference is that in the black church case, no-one denies that racism was a prime factor. The shooter and his ilk made the flag front and center. A flag that very people who created it, made clear that it was about race and slavery.

What the post-attack uproar says about those who fly the Confederate Battle Flag is nothing new. It simply restated the obvious.

Answer this: (Though no doubt you'll evade, change the subject or run away.)

Do you honestly not see the difference?

Point proved. 6 sentences in supposed response and not a single word answering rstrong's question about the clear differences between the SC and OR shootings. The only question is whether Seth Milner is that stupid, that wussy or both.

[Vrede too]

I see silly comments and vile names being thrown at people who wish to defend their rights to own weapons, while blaming gun-related crimes on those who support gun rights as if gun-owners are responsible for criminals having guns.

Every criminal gun was a legal one at some point.

Gun control will work exactly as well as the war on drugs and the Prohibition. Everything will go as smooth as clockwork.

Dumb comparison. No one is talking about gun prohibition, just reasonable regulation of guns and gun owners.

... Let's say gun control of some way, shape, or form is enacted; now what? Honest people will be the ones to suffer most, because despite any measures in place, some crooked somebody somewhere is going to skirt any laws just to make money. It's already been seen in the news.

That's the NRA dogma, one that's contradicted by the lower violence rates in every other developed democracy. Think for yourself much? Your "investigative journalism" must have been a hoot!

Also, there was no indication that the mixed race guy was motivated by racism like the white guy was and, as both rstrong and O Really imply, there was no shortage of criticism of the NRA in the wake of the Charleston massacre.

Points run away from, as usual, wimp.

Obviously the motivation, to you, was the NRA's opposition to the notion that (carte blanch) individual gun ownership is to blame for all crime.

Nope, just a lot of gun crime. Your lame straw men are pitiful.

Naturally, honest gun-owners are to blame for all gun-related crimes.

Where did the criminals get their guns?

You poster is inaccurate, racist and dumb, Seth Milner.

Points run away from by substituting idiotic pop-psychology, as usual, coward.

[Seth Milner]

Point proved. 6 sentences in supposed response and not a single word answering rstrong's question about the clear differences between the SC and OR shootings. The only question is whether Seth Milner is that stupid, that wussy or both.

Point proved. Vrede too's obsession with me and overwhelming desire to prove himself superior is clear evidence of a narcissistic personality disorder. Get help Vrede too.

[Seth Milner]

Think for yourself much? Your "investigative journalism" must have been a hoot!
Points run away from, as usual, wimp.
Your lame straw men are pitiful.
Points run away from by substituting idiotic pop-psychology, as usual, coward.

Your words are you....
Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) is a personality disorder in which a person is excessively preoccupied with personal adequacy, power, prestige and vanity, mentally unable to see the destructive damage they are causing to themselves and others. It is a cluster B personality disorder (also a mind that is a cluster fuck)

[rstrong]

Point proved. 6 sentences in supposed response and not a single word answering rstrong's question about the clear differences between the SC and OR shootings.

Just so. Milner, you made no attempt whatsoever to answer the question. You just - as usual - evaded and changed the subject.

Meanwhile your arguments about the NRA might have been credible in the Reagan era - when even Wayne LaPierre and the NRA called for criminal background checks.

But now the NRA is now a mere propaganda arm of the Republican Party. As Democratic leaders became demonstrably more pro-gun than even Reagan and other 1970s and '80s Republicans, the NRA has to get more extremist in it's Democrat boogyman claims. It's now a self-parody, calling for guns in every kindergarten and screaming that criminal background checks and other simple common-sense measures (again, that even Wayne LaPierre used to call for) will result in everyone's guns being taken away. And that's not even exaggeration or hyperbole on my part. What you wrote has no credibility today.

Do you honestly not see that?

Forget I asked.

As for your parroting "Gun control will work exactly as well as the war on drugs and the Prohibition". There's vast amounts in money in drugs and alcohol - and in for-profit prisons - but not in mass shootings or people being shot by toddlers on a weekly basis. (Yes. By toddlers. Three or younger. Roughly once a week in America.)

Here in reality there are better comparisons: For example in the early 1970s, stricter drunk driving penalties cut drunk driving deaths by two thirds. They didn't take everyone's cars away. They didn't ban drinking. They merely forced those with cars and drinks to take some personal responsibility. It's the same with gun regulations.

C'mon, THINK!

[Vrede too]

All topical points (inaccurate, racist and dumb) run away from by substituting idiotic pop-psychology and whining about me, as usual, coward.

[O Really]

This is what I mean about blaming the NRA. Every gun crime is directly or indirectly blamed on the NRA because they fiercely support the 2nd. Amendment. This is the liberal way. Let's say gun control of some way, shape, or form is enacted; now what? Honest people will be the ones to suffer most, because despite any measures in place, some crooked somebody somewhere is going to skirt any laws just to make money. It's already been seen in the news.

Taking an organization's slogan at face value is a little shallow, wouldn't you say? Sure, the NRA sees itself as a fierce supporter of the Second Amendment. The KKK was originally formed "to combat a series of post Civil War policy decisions that many of the southern citizenry felt was unfair and oppressive." Sounds pretty high-minded to me. But it's not so much the intent, whether sincere and worthy or not, it's the method and actual effects that determine whether it's a hateable organization.

BTW, while criminals will always get things, including guns, illegally, most firearm deaths aren't caused by those we'd look at as a "criminal". They're mostly caused by people without much if any of a former record, often by a relative or person close to the victim, or by somebody with a long-standing grudge. And most of the time, with guns obtained legally. Why is that?

[Seth Milner]

Do you honestly not see that?
SSee what?

Forget I asked.
OK

C'mon, THINK!
I've thought about it and have decided I really don't care one way or the other. I'm not going to waste my time looking up facts and figures just to appease a bunch of leftwing nut jobs who can only see a few feet in front of them. I'd much rather whine about Vrede too; he feels he should be the center of attention anyway.

[Vrede too]

... Honest people will be the ones to suffer most ...

Taking an organization's slogan at face value is a little shallow, wouldn't you say? Sure, the NRA sees itself as a fierce supporter of the Second Amendment. The KKK was originally formed "to combat a series of post Civil War policy decisions that many of the southern citizenry felt was unfair and oppressive." Sounds pretty high-minded to me. But it's not so much the intent, whether sincere and worthy or not, it's the method and actual effects that determine whether it's a hateable organization.

BTW, while criminals will always get things, including guns, illegally, most firearm deaths aren't caused by those we'd look at as a "criminal". They're mostly caused by people without much if any of a former record, often by a relative or person close to the victim, or by somebody with a long-standing grudge. And most of the time, with guns obtained legally. Why is that?

Good point, Seth Milner runs away from discussion of all the accidents, suicides and first time crimes involving guns held by his "Honest people", not to mention that his serial lies and cowardice when the lies are exposed excludes him from that group, anyhow.

[O Really]

... I'm not going to waste my time looking up facts and figures ... I'd much rather whine about Vrede too; he feels he should be the center of attention anyway. [/color]

[/quote]
They just can't get enough of you, can they? Like flies to honey, or, more appropriately, moths to a flame.

[Vrede too]

As I've said for awhile, whining about me is his prime reason for being here. It's funny that Seth Milner's first caterwauling was about you, O Really, calling him a coward when you hadn't. Even though it was all just his illiterate paranoia it turns out to have been correct.

... C'mon, THINK!

... I'm not going to waste my time looking up facts and figures (when faced with facts, logic and figures)...

Translation:



But he doesn't have the stones to admit the obvious failings in his inaccurate, racist and dumb poster. I wonder if he sees or will ever admit the irony in a discussion forum participant and retiree saying he won't "waste ... time", and in an "investigative journalist" saying he won't be "looking up facts and figures". Probably not.

[O Really]

Damn, if only the other driver had been armed, or maybe if the kid had been armed, this tragic death of a 4-year old wouldn't have happened.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/21/us/child-road-rage-death/

Probably also wouldn't have happened if the kid's dad hadn't been playing road games, too.

[Seth Milner]

As I've said for awhile, whining about me is his prime reason for being here.
You're just a poor little innocent victim that everyone picks on, aren't you? Cry us a river, will you? Some areas still need the water.

It's funny that Seth Milner's first caterwauling was about you, O Really, calling him a coward when you hadn't. Even though it was all just his illiterate paranoia it turns out to have been correct.
What's funny is your attempting to illicit other's opinions into your off-the-wall ding-battiness. Doesn't appear they're biting or really wanting to associate themselves with a narcissist, does it?

But he doesn't have the stones to admit the obvious failings in his inaccurate, racist and dumb poster.
What's the point in fueling your NPD any further? You have already proved to me and others here that your satisfaction comes from belittling and ridiculing.

I wonder if he sees or will ever admit the irony.....
Here's the irony: I wonder if you see or will ever admit that you are merely a narcissist.

I wonder if he sees or will ever admit the irony in a discussion forum participant and retiree saying he won't "waste ... time", and in an "investigative journalist" saying he won't be "looking up facts and figures". Probably not.
And that really galls your ass that I won't embroil my self in your pathetic mind games, don't it?

BTW, in case you haven't noticed, none of your peers have come to your defense re my claims of your NPD. Own it. It's all yours.

[O Really]

Do you consider calling someone a "narcissist" an insult, Seth?
If you've read much about it, you've probably found that the best way to find out if a person is a narcissist is just to ask them. Generally, they're not hiding anything.

BTW, you ever notice that "Vrede" and SVengali both have "V's" in them?