College sports

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billy.pilgrim
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Re: College sports

Unread post by billy.pilgrim »

Vrede too wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:01 pm
billy.pilgrim wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:57 am
... Graduate assistants get paid for teaching classes and for other work, not for writing their PhD. They save the school money by not having to hire full time teachers with degrees.

Absolutely I agree with some form of payment from the school and a kid should absolutely be able to sell his own name. But you are definitely off into apples and oranges land comparing sports to graduate assistants.
SCOTUS has partially changed the playing field:
Supreme Court unanimously rules against NCAA in athlete compensation case

The nation's highest court unanimously ruled against the NCAA in the case of the NCAA vs. Alston, stating that its strict rules limiting certain kinds of athlete compensation violate anti-trust laws.

Justice Neil Gorsuch wrote the unanimous opinion, upholding the lower court's ruling that the NCAA was acting unlawfully when it limited member schools from competing for the talent of athletes by offering benefits. Limiting schools from actually, truly competing hurt college athletes.

The ruling is fairly narrow and does not end amateurism in college sports. The NCAA is still allowed to forbid benefits that are not related to an athlete's education. However, it allows for college athletes to receive education-based benefits like free laptops and paid post-grad internships.

'The NCAA is not above the law'

Even though the ruling only affects education-based benefits for college athletes, it could have a much greater impact in the future. By denying the NCAA anti-trust protection, the Supreme Court opened the door for others to file anti-trust lawsuits against the NCAA. If more anti-trust lawsuits are filed, this searing quote from Justice Brett Kavanaugh's concurring opinion doesn't bode well for the NCAA.

This one sentence from Kavanaugh's concurring opinion may be the most consequential of all.



Even though the ruling is limited, this whole Supreme Court process could not have gone worse for the NCAA. In late March it got roasted during oral arguments, with each of the justices taking shots at the NCAA like it was the world's largest and least-challenging piñata.

Now it has not only lost, it lost unanimously, and both opinions were written by two of the court's more conservative justices. As if that wasn't enough, one of the opinions essentially called the NCAA's business model "flatly illegal." This may be just the beginning of the NCAA's legal woes.
I'm not sure if it was Gorsuch or Boof, but one of them raked the NCAA leadership and coaches salaries.
:---P
More to come.
Not sure why I'm being quoted here. I see no connection between what I said and the SC ruling.
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Re: College sports

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billy.pilgrim wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:25 pm
Not sure why I'm being quoted here. I see no connection between what I said and the SC ruling.
Huh? It's clearly a connected matter since you and now SCOTUS both “agree with some form of payment from the school” (your words). You should be happy, at least as a first step.

Besides, I thought you’d appreciate the acknowledgment that I had read your post. Since I post plenty as it is, I don’t always reply unless I’ve got something new to say. However, I will quote as a hopefully polite “Hi” when I am finally adding to a topic.

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Re: College sports

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Vrede too wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:51 am
billy.pilgrim wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:25 pm
Not sure why I'm being quoted here. I see no connection between what I said and the SC ruling.
Huh? It's clearly a connected matter since you and now SCOTUS both “agree with some form of payment from the school” (your words). You should be happy, at least as a first step.

Besides, I thought you’d appreciate the acknowledgment that I had read your post. Since I post plenty as it is, I don’t always reply unless I’ve got something new to say. However, I will quote as a hopefully polite “Hi” when I am finally adding to a topic.
I still don't see the connection. Grad Assistants are paid for teaching, not for working on a degree. Besides, GA jobs are open to players who have graduated.

And ol Boof, I reckon he stuck that "almost" in there because he remembered all the real world work for free apprenticeship jobs in the real world.

Anyway it hardly matters to me anymore. I'm convinced that paying athletes is fine. Anything else is as stupid as the war on drugs. Kids are being paid, championships made and careers built on rewarding the best cheaters. Time to open it up.
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Re: College sports

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billy.pilgrim wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:34 am
I still don't see the connection. Grad Assistants are paid for teaching, not for working on a degree. Besides, GA jobs are open to players who have graduated.

And ol Boof, I reckon he stuck that "almost" in there because he remembered all the real world work for free apprenticeship jobs in the real world.

Anyway it hardly matters to me anymore. I'm convinced that paying athletes is fine. Anything else is as stupid as the war on drugs. Kids are being paid, championships made and careers built on rewarding the best cheaters. Time to open it up.
Huh? Grad Assistants are irrelevant. The connection is that you support paying athletes and now unanimous SCOTUS does, somewhat, while opening the door for more. Again, be happy.

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Re: College sports

Unread post by billy.pilgrim »

Vrede too wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:40 am
billy.pilgrim wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:34 am
I still don't see the connection. Grad Assistants are paid for teaching, not for working on a degree. Besides, GA jobs are open to players who have graduated.

And ol Boof, I reckon he stuck that "almost" in there because he remembered all the real world work for free apprenticeship jobs in the real world.

Anyway it hardly matters to me anymore. I'm convinced that paying athletes is fine. Anything else is as stupid as the war on drugs. Kids are being paid, championships made and careers built on rewarding the best cheaters. Time to open it up.
Huh? Grad Assistants are irrelevant. The connection is that you support paying athletes and now unanimous SCOTUS does, somewhat, while opening the door for more. Again, be happy.

The author of the article you posted https://www.epi.org/blog/college-football-pay/
doesn't seem to understand that apples aren't oranges.

Me, I'm mostly good with paying them, But the hidden republican consequences that prompted ol boof to lie about working for free to gain experience is far more scary. People do it all the time, especially attorneys.

There is a much bigger picture being ignored while we joyously celebrate taking down the ncaa, but republicans won't touch the worse excuse for a free trade business model that has ever existed. The nfl is a rich man's monopoly that doesn't allow competition. Take away the monopoly and run it like the colleges run sports and almost all the problems (money) dissappear. The ncaa division 1 covers about 120 teams. Imagine a 120 team nfl - you might actually get to go to a few games.

As screwed up as it is, the ncaa is open to any school that accepts its rules.

Now for boof's reason for taking the football and basketball money away from the schools -
As there's always a reason, just as most of us were joyful when the draft was ended, we are now in forever wars and military politicians. Likely it won't be long before the military keeps moving up the social ladder at the expense of all.
It doesn't go back.

Could Boof and the republicans have sights on strangling Title IX by taking the money away from the schools, or is this just another distraction?
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Re: College sports

Unread post by Vrede too »

billy.pilgrim wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 2:43 pm
The author of the article you posted https://www.epi.org/blog/college-football-pay/
doesn't seem to understand that apples aren't oranges.

Me, I'm mostly good with paying them, But the hidden republican consequences that prompted ol boof to lie about working for free to gain experience is far more scary. People do it all the time, especially attorneys.

There is a much bigger picture being ignored while we joyously celebrate taking down the ncaa, but republicans won't touch the worse excuse for a free trade business model that has ever existed. The nfl is a rich man's monopoly that doesn't allow competition. Take away the monopoly and run it like the colleges run sports and almost all the problems (money) dissappear. The ncaa division 1 covers about 120 teams. Imagine a 120 team nfl - you might actually get to go to a few games.

As screwed up as it is, the ncaa is open to any school that accepts its rules.

Now for boof's reason for taking the football and basketball money away from the schools -
As there's always a reason, just as most of us were joyful when the draft was ended, we are now in forever wars and military politicians. Likely it won't be long before the military keeps moving up the social ladder at the expense of all.
It doesn't go back.

Could Boof and the republicans have sights on strangling Title IX by taking the money away from the schools, or is this just another distraction?
I'm not clear what you're accusing Boof of.
You supposedly support paying student athletes, too.
This was a unanimous SCOTUS ruling supporting education-based benefits for college athletes.
The author believes that the Boof quote is important, but it is just one quote from a concurring opinion and was probably presented in some sort of context.

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Re: College sports

Unread post by billy.pilgrim »

Vrede too wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:00 pm
billy.pilgrim wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 2:43 pm
The author of the article you posted https://www.epi.org/blog/college-football-pay/
doesn't seem to understand that apples aren't oranges.

Me, I'm mostly good with paying them, But the hidden republican consequences that prompted ol boof to lie about working for free to gain experience is far more scary. People do it all the time, especially attorneys.

There is a much bigger picture being ignored while we joyously celebrate taking down the ncaa, but republicans won't touch the worse excuse for a free trade business model that has ever existed. The nfl is a rich man's monopoly that doesn't allow competition. Take away the monopoly and run it like the colleges run sports and almost all the problems (money) dissappear. The ncaa division 1 covers about 120 teams. Imagine a 120 team nfl - you might actually get to go to a few games.

As screwed up as it is, the ncaa is open to any school that accepts its rules.

Now for boof's reason for taking the football and basketball money away from the schools -
As there's always a reason, just as most of us were joyful when the draft was ended, we are now in forever wars and military politicians. Likely it won't be long before the military keeps moving up the social ladder at the expense of all.
It doesn't go back.

Could Boof and the republicans have sights on strangling Title IX by taking the money away from the schools, or is this just another distraction?
I'm not clear what you're accusing Boof of.
You supposedly support paying student athletes, too.
This was a unanimous SCOTUS ruling supporting education-based benefits for college athletes.
The author believes that the Boof quote is important, but it is just one quote from a concurring opinion and was probably presented in some sort of context.
I agree with the decision, just not with why this decision is necessary without addressing the bigger problem of monopoly money in the nfl and republicans have taught me to never trust a republican, not even when the dems go along - volunteer draft, war on drugs, Afghanistan, Iraq, interstate highways, tax cuts for the rich that will end in 10 years if they don't work, etc.
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Re: College sports

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I don't trust RepuQ's either, but what's wrong with interstate highways, other than I-10 being a total piece of bone jarring crap most of the way?

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Re: College sports

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billy.pilgrim wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 4:33 pm
I agree with the decision, just not with why this decision is necessary without addressing the bigger problem of monopoly money in the nfl and republicans have taught me to never trust a republican, not even when the dems go along - volunteer draft, war on drugs, Afghanistan, Iraq, interstate highways, tax cuts for the rich that will end in 10 years if they don't work, etc.
Ah. I don't care enough to research the case history, but rulings are often limited to the specifics of the case that was brought to the court. It's rare for the court to be expansive and such rulings usually aren't unanimous when it is.

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Re: College sports

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Does "ol Boof" refer to Brett Kavanaugh?

I dimly remember the word being mentioned during his senate supreme court nomination hearings.

But just now I decided to look it up. It has some, er, unsavory meanings. Learn something every day.

https://www.vox.com/2018/9/27/17911728/ ... reme-court

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Re: College sports

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O Really wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 4:35 pm
I don't trust RepuQ's either, but what's wrong with interstate highways, other than I-10 being a total piece of bone jarring crap most of the way?
Ask the tens of thousands of farmers who had their farms cut through, or the small businesses that closed so huge trucks could transport foreign made cheaper crap to big box stores. I could go on, but again it was a big business lie supported by republican claiming that it was all about military defense.
Whole communities of "difference" have been reduced to McDonald's and huge gas stations as we fly by.

I really don't see the need, but I do see the waste.
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Re: College sports

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Ulysses wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:54 am
Does "ol Boof" refer to Brett Kavanaugh?

I dimly remember the word being mentioned during his senate supreme court nomination hearings.

But just now I decided to look it up. It has some, er, unsavory meanings. Learn something every day.

https://www.vox.com/2018/9/27/17911728/ ... reme-court
It was interesting that the wiki definition was changed during the hearings to fit his innocent definition.
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Re: College sports

Unread post by Vrede too »

billy.pilgrim wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 2:43 pm
The author of the article you posted https://www.epi.org/blog/college-football-pay/
doesn't seem to understand that apples aren't oranges.

Me, I'm mostly good with paying them, But the hidden republican consequences that prompted ol boof to lie about working for free to gain experience is far more scary. People do it all the time, especially attorneys.

There is a much bigger picture being ignored while we joyously celebrate taking down the ncaa, but republicans won't touch the worse excuse for a free trade business model that has ever existed. The nfl is a rich man's monopoly that doesn't allow competition. Take away the monopoly and run it like the colleges run sports and almost all the problems (money) dissappear. The ncaa division 1 covers about 120 teams. Imagine a 120 team nfl - you might actually get to go to a few games.

As screwed up as it is, the ncaa is open to any school that accepts its rules.

Now for boof's reason for taking the football and basketball money away from the schools -
As there's always a reason, just as most of us were joyful when the draft was ended, we are now in forever wars and military politicians. Likely it won't be long before the military keeps moving up the social ladder at the expense of all.
It doesn't go back.

Could Boof and the republicans have sights on strangling Title IX by taking the money away from the schools, or is this just another distraction?
billy.pilgrim wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 4:33 pm
Vrede too wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:00 pm
I'm not clear what you're accusing Boof of.
You supposedly support paying student athletes, too.
This was a unanimous SCOTUS ruling supporting education-based benefits for college athletes.
The author believes that the Boof quote is important, but it is just one quote from a concurring opinion and was probably presented in some sort of context.
I agree with the decision, just not with why this decision is necessary without addressing the bigger problem of monopoly money in the nfl and republicans have taught me to never trust a republican, not even when the dems go along - volunteer draft, war on drugs, Afghanistan, Iraq, interstate highways, tax cuts for the rich that will end in 10 years if they don't work, etc.
Issue evolution:
National Labor Relations Board: College athletes are employees of their schools

... NLRB general counsel Jennifer Abruzzo issued a memo Wednesday outlining why she believes that college players are employees of their schools and afforded protections under the National Labor Relations Act.

Abruzzo’s memo cites recent developments in the college sports world like the ability for players to make money off their name and image rights, the recent NCAA v. Alston Supreme Court decision and the net worth of the total compensation that players get from their schools in the form of scholarships and stipends....

Abruzzo's position is yet another step forward for college athletes as the college sports landscape continues to evolve. While her position does not immediately change anything for college athletes, it offers a level of protection for athletes from NCAA member schools attempting to classify players as "student-athletes" and not employees....

Simply put, any school that attempts to legally argue that athletes are not employees and are instead student-athlete will face a challenge from the National Labor Relations Board. The NLRB is a powerful entity and is clearly willing to go toe-to-toe with the NCAA. Will the NCAA and its schools be open to fights with the NLRB? Or will the memo pave the way for future NCAA reforms without a bunch of legal wrangling? We'll find out fairly soon.

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Re: College sports

Unread post by billy.pilgrim »

Vrede too wrote:
Sat Oct 02, 2021 1:48 pm
billy.pilgrim wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 2:43 pm
The author of the article you posted https://www.epi.org/blog/college-football-pay/
doesn't seem to understand that apples aren't oranges.

Me, I'm mostly good with paying them, But the hidden republican consequences that prompted ol boof to lie about working for free to gain experience is far more scary. People do it all the time, especially attorneys.

There is a much bigger picture being ignored while we joyously celebrate taking down the ncaa, but republicans won't touch the worse excuse for a free trade business model that has ever existed. The nfl is a rich man's monopoly that doesn't allow competition. Take away the monopoly and run it like the colleges run sports and almost all the problems (money) dissappear. The ncaa division 1 covers about 120 teams. Imagine a 120 team nfl - you might actually get to go to a few games.

As screwed up as it is, the ncaa is open to any school that accepts its rules.

Now for boof's reason for taking the football and basketball money away from the schools -
As there's always a reason, just as most of us were joyful when the draft was ended, we are now in forever wars and military politicians. Likely it won't be long before the military keeps moving up the social ladder at the expense of all.
It doesn't go back.

Could Boof and the republicans have sights on strangling Title IX by taking the money away from the schools, or is this just another distraction?
billy.pilgrim wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 4:33 pm
Vrede too wrote:
Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:00 pm
I'm not clear what you're accusing Boof of.
You supposedly support paying student athletes, too.
This was a unanimous SCOTUS ruling supporting education-based benefits for college athletes.
The author believes that the Boof quote is important, but it is just one quote from a concurring opinion and was probably presented in some sort of context.
I agree with the decision, just not with why this decision is necessary without addressing the bigger problem of monopoly money in the nfl and republicans have taught me to never trust a republican, not even when the dems go along - volunteer draft, war on drugs, Afghanistan, Iraq, interstate highways, tax cuts for the rich that will end in 10 years if they don't work, etc.
Issue evolution:
National Labor Relations Board: College athletes are employees of their schools

... NLRB general counsel Jennifer Abruzzo issued a memo Wednesday outlining why she believes that college players are employees of their schools and afforded protections under the National Labor Relations Act.

Abruzzo’s memo cites recent developments in the college sports world like the ability for players to make money off their name and image rights, the recent NCAA v. Alston Supreme Court decision and the net worth of the total compensation that players get from their schools in the form of scholarships and stipends....

Abruzzo's position is yet another step forward for college athletes as the college sports landscape continues to evolve. While her position does not immediately change anything for college athletes, it offers a level of protection for athletes from NCAA member schools attempting to classify players as "student-athletes" and not employees....

Simply put, any school that attempts to legally argue that athletes are not employees and are instead student-athlete will face a challenge from the National Labor Relations Board. The NLRB is a powerful entity and is clearly willing to go toe-to-toe with the NCAA. Will the NCAA and its schools be open to fights with the NLRB? Or will the memo pave the way for future NCAA reforms without a bunch of legal wrangling? We'll find out fairly soon.
Oh well, this could easily be the end of many sports, especially women's sports, when schools have to decide between paying players or paying professors.

As I said, wingers play the long game, always have - it's why they win. This is more about ending Title 9 than it is about players being employees
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Re: College sports

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I haven't read the details, but it looks like this would only apply to scholarship players. It's pretty easy to make that argument since the scholarship players are receiving payment for performing work benefitting (mostly) the schools - although the players do or may receive personal benefit also. It's a little harder to make it work for non-scholarship sports that generate little (or negative) revenue. On the other hand, one could argue that all sports are the same, or at least all part of one enterprise, and all athletes in all sports must be compensated at least minimum wage, paid overtime when worked, and are subject to child labor laws if any are under 18.

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Re: College sports

Unread post by billy.pilgrim »

What's that about when you get a lemon

Olivia spent her pandemic quarantine time making videos and now with NIL she's about to make some money.

https://nypost.com/2021/10/08/inside-th ... -movement/

"Dunne is currently the most-followed collegiate athlete across the combined social platforms. Her Twitter account also has more than 17,000 followers."

'“I was quarantined in Florida and I just started making content at the beach, doing flips and filming it. My videos started to get on the ‘for you’ page [on Instagram] a lot more, so more people saw them … and it took off,” Dunne said. “Then I went to LSU"

"'At the level of followers that [Dunne] has, she could easily make close to north of $1 million dollars in annual income,” Thompson said."
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Re: College sports

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billy.pilgrim wrote:
Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:10 am
What's that about when you get a lemon ...
Ah, to be young, hot, blonde, lithe and now rich . . .

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Re: College sports

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This is ridiculous. Coulda been in "Dumb Headlines" but then it turns out it wasn't just the headline. Kelly Ripa's youngest son is a very good wrestler, and got a (not really needed) wrestling scholarship to the University of Michigan, sometimes referred to as 'Big Blue", home of one of the best fight songs ever, but never referred to as "Michigan State."

So the headline says "...Joaquin shares update from Michigan State University". Immediately below is a pic probably 10 years old showing off daughter Lola's huge boobs. Then the pic of Joaquin at wrestling practice wearing an "M" shirt and hashtagged #goblue. Below that is a pic of Joaquin and Mark wearing their Michigan sweat shirts. And immediately below that...wait for it... "Joaquin announced he would be attending Michigan State this fall back in March."
Idiots.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/ke ... li=AAggNb9

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Re: College sports

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O Really wrote:
Tue Oct 26, 2021 11:51 am
This is ridiculous. Coulda been in "Dumb Headlines" but then it turns out it wasn't just the headline. Kelly Ripa's youngest son is a very good wrestler, and got a (not really needed) wrestling scholarship to the University of Michigan, sometimes referred to as 'Big Blue", home of one of the best fight songs ever, but never referred to as "Michigan State."

So the headline says "...Joaquin shares update from Michigan State University". Immediately below is a pic probably 10 years old showing off daughter Lola's huge boobs. Then the pic of Joaquin at wrestling practice wearing an "M" shirt and hashtagged #goblue. Below that is a pic of Joaquin and Mark wearing their Michigan sweat shirts. And immediately below that...wait for it... "Joaquin announced he would be attending Michigan State this fall back in March."
Idiots.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/ke ... li=AAggNb9
Image = 2 strikes against it before a single word was typed. :P

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Re: College sports

Unread post by Vrede too »

billy.pilgrim wrote:
Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:10 am
What's that about when you get a lemon

Olivia spent her pandemic quarantine time making videos and now with NIL she's about to make some money.

https://nypost.com/2021/10/08/inside-th ... -movement/

"Dunne is currently the most-followed collegiate athlete across the combined social platforms. Her Twitter account also has more than 17,000 followers."

'“I was quarantined in Florida and I just started making content at the beach, doing flips and filming it. My videos started to get on the ‘for you’ page [on Instagram] a lot more, so more people saw them … and it took off,” Dunne said. “Then I went to LSU"

"'At the level of followers that [Dunne] has, she could easily make close to north of $1 million dollars in annual income,” Thompson said."
Vrede too wrote:
Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:38 am
Ah, to be young, hot, blonde, lithe and now rich . . .
Image

Idk about y'all, but I pictured NIL money flowing to football and men's basketball players. Maybe that's happening, but hot blondes definitely seem to be raking the dollars in. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised.
Money keeps pouring in for Fresno State basketball’s Cavinder twins. New deal is next-level

Fresno State basketball players Haley and Hanna Cavinder, who could earn close to or more than seven figures this year through Name, Image and Likeness endorsements, have landed an innovative deal with a new clothing company that includes a 25% ownership stake and one of three seats on its board of directors, according to Forbes....

The Cavinder twins, who signed a deal with Boost Mobile on the first day college student-athletes could profit from their name, image and likeness and have since landed a number of high-profile deals, are believed to be the first to land a seat on a company’s board of directors....
5′ 6″ guards. Both are pretty good, but 7-9 Fresno State of the mid-major Mountain West is so-so at best. Not exactly elite athletes. However, they do TikTok dance videos and:

Image

It's a whole new world in college sports. We'll see how it goes.

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